Goldberg Help

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• (August 06, 2008, 10:47:20 PM)

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Matt

[thedragonreborn]

Okay here's my Goldberg deck

Pre-Match
Old School Antics x2
Dance, Coach, Dance!
GGGGGGooooolllllldd dddd-berg!
Premiere Raw Superstar
Velocity

Mid-Match
Backlash x3 (Just Realized I can't Pack these)
Atomic Bear Hug x2
Chase Off Manager
That's J.R.'s Animal Hat Trick, Folks!
Check This Out!
Clear the Way x2

Actions
Who's Next?
Testicular Fortitude
He's Runnin' Like a Scalded Dog
Gettin' Beat Like a Government Mule
Defensive Style x2
Absolutely Raw
Believe the Hype
Beat You Raw
Energy Burst
Where's the Payoff?
J.R.Style Action x2
Here's a Ratings Booster!x2
One of A Kind
This Has Gone Over by...Three Minutes
Simply the Best
Beating the Odds
From The Mind of Eric Bischoff x3
Puppies! Puppies!
He's As Crazy as a Pet Racoon

Hybrid Manuever/Reversals
Bulldog Lariat
Abdominal Rake x2
Back Rake x2
Eye Rake x3
Nerve Hold x3
Spear x3
Ensugiri (TB) x2
Inside Cradle x2
Backslide x3
Goldberg's Spear

Manuevers
Goldberg's Jackhammer
Suicide Dive
Brainbuster
Arm Breaker
Jackhammer x3
Hangman's Neck Breaker
Punch After Punch x2
Kick x3
Atomic Lariat

Originally I set out to model this deck after my Batista Deck which is Undefeated among my local playgroup.  However it quickly became apparent that Goldberg was no Batista.  The problems I'm having is that the Hybrid Reversals mostly cost 7 fortitude (a couple are cheaper) making them difficult to play.  Also I don't seem to have the muscle to always win a game. 

So any suggestion for Hybrid Reversals that are easier to play or would work better than the ones I have?  What are some manuevers that might help me?  Should I ditch JR Animal Hat Trick completely?  What can I replace Backlash with in my Backlash?  Any help that could make this deck better would be greatly appreciated!

[Buddha Dudley]

The old standby in Goldberg's Pre-Match is The Best Laid Plans. That way you can use "GGGGGGooooolllllldd dddd-berg" with impunity and not worry about having a small handsize afterwards. Premiere Raw otherwise is still a solid build for Goldberg. Managed by Eric Bischoff is also good for the irreversibility it gives to From the Mind of Eric Bischoff and combined with Dance Coach Dance allows you to play irreversible From the Mind of EB turn 1 so that you can pick up all those Raw logo'd cards you discarded for "GGGGGGooooolllllldd dddd-berg" and start the Raw logos early and often. Finally your pre-match needs to be rounded out with Rules Were Meant To Be Broken, there's some good synergy here with The Best Laid Plans and later on in a certain Steel Chain Shot (TB) you're missing.

Leg Drag (TB) is better than Ensugiri (TB) simply because its less Fortitude and doesn't need a Kick qualifier (which seems out of place in a Goldberg deck) in your ring to play from you hand. Also Strangle Holds (TB) are also good hybrid Clutch/Submission reversals. Another good maneuver you can add as an extra win condition is Slingshot into the Ring Post which also fits in nicely to Premiere Raw.

Finally, you're missing Goldberg's best weapon, Steel Chain Shot (TB). These are a must as well as it's best friend, When Kurt Met Christy. You can also throw in all the other movie cards so you can retrieve 3x Steel Chain Shot (TB)s every turn to hand after you use When Kurt Met Christy to search for other movies. This all feeds extra cards to either search for a maneuver via ability, reverse opponent's maneuver via ability or reverse with Rules Were Meant To Be Broken.

[thedragonreborn]

Great.  So I'll take out the JR Animal Hat Trick Cards from Movie actions, and replace kicks with TB Steel Chainshots and the Ensugiri with Leg Drags.  I think I only used Ensugiri and Kicks because I wanted something cheap that did damage.  What set is the Best Laid Plans from?  Would it be best to replace Velocity and add both Best Laid Plans and Managed by Eric Bischoff?  I was also considering a title belt to increase my chances of going first.  Is there any particular title belt that would work best for Goldberg?  I had thougt the World Title with the Raw Logo might be the best place to go if I did that.

Any thoughts on something that could take the place of Backlash! in my Backlash deck?

[Daeva]

The Best Laid Plans... is from Great American Bash.

You might want to consider Silent but Violent, or some cheap Raw cards, like Here Comes the Coach or You Can't Spell Furniture Without F-U-N.

[Buddha Dudley]

Velocity isn't the worst card, but The Best Laid Plans will probably work out better in your favor in conjunction with "GGGGGGooooolllllldd dddd-berg" especially when you pack Heel cards.

As for Title Belts, you can choose either my personal favorite in the Spinner Belt or the World Heavyweight Title Belt to search for a From the Mind and better fuel Dance Coach Dance. Raw IC Belt is also a free Raw Logo for DCD.

As for Mid-Match cards, on top of Daeva's fine choices, Raw Deal is a good one considering his specifcs IE Spear and Jackhammer are also Raw logo'd. Grab the Ref is also good against plunging and The Road to Victory is always nice.

[darkcolts77]

grab the ref
phoenix rising
silent but violent
raw deal
settle down son
get off my program
ring general
road to victory
fully loaded
how important is it

[Cythe]

I'v enever run him myself, but I've seen Stun the Crowds in Goldberg, gives your maneuvers more punch and draw power for use with his ability.

[thedragonreborn]

Great.  Thanks for the help everyone.  I'm going to go through my extras and do some rebuilding depending on what I have.  Hopefully Goldberg can start winning with a little bit of help.  Once I get this deck running I'll post some other underperforming decks and see if I can't get any help there too.

[crimsonrebel]

use three atomic lariats if you have them

[thedragonreborn]

Okay I found a few cards suggested and am making changes.  I did have a question about one card suggested that I found.  Grab The Ref says it can only be played when my opponent is modifying my reversal cards.  What would be an example of that?  Is it just when a player adds +Fortitude to my reversals?

Another question.  How does a Goldberg deck deal with Denville, New Jersey?  Normally I would say use GGGGGGooooolllllldd dddd-berg, but it sounds like that ability happens when it comes into play.  I realize you can't prepare for every eventuality, but a card that destroys Goldberg because he can't pack anything but Hybrid Reversals doesn't seem right.

[Daeva]

Grab the Ref can be played whenever your opponent modifies your reversals in any way, including adding Damage to them (Running Lariat), making them deal no Damage at all (Revolution Underestimate the Competition or Batista's Ability), increasing their Fortitude (Fans Love an Underdog or Get Crowd Support), or adding text to them (Raw or Smackdown: Pick a Brand!). It only removes Fortitude modifications, however.

As for Denville, as a 5 Superstar Value, you can play a Venue before your opponent gets a chance to more often than not. (If your local meta is all Evolutions and Hulk Hogans, you're out of luck on that front, though.) If you can't beat them to a Venue, you just have to suck it up and console yourself with the fact that he's made your deck leaner and meaner and you'll find all of your good cards quicker.

[thedragonreborn]

Okay.  So Grab the Ref only prevents modifications to Fortitude, but a card like Frankie Takes Ho-llywood gives reversals the restricted Modification symbol.  Does that prevent them from being altered in anyway including both fortitude and damage?  And does that card prevent Batista's no damage from reversals ability from working?

[Jazzaman]

Yes to all questions Frankie annoys Batista somewhat.

Jay

[thedragonreborn]

Good to know.  I actually am going to be using Frankie is my Torrie Wilson deck, but I wanted to check while there was discussion about modifications to reversals.  Also, since Batista is my primary deck I like to keep informed of cards that could reduce his usefullness.

[thedragonreborn]

Modified my Goldberg deck

Pre-Match
Old School Antics x2
Best Laid Plans...
Dance, Coach, Dance!
GGGGGGooooolllllldd dddd-berg!
Premiere Raw Supestar
Rules Were Meant to Be Broken

Mid-Match
Silent, But Violent x3
Atomic Bear Hug x2
Chase Off Manager
Ready to Fight x2
Clear the Way x2

Actions
Who's Next?
Testicular Fortitude
Defensive Style x2
Absolutely Raw
Believe the Hype
Beat You Raw
Energy Burst
Where's the Payoff?
J.R.Style Action x2
Here's a Ratings Booster!x2
One of A Kind
This Has Gone Over by...Three Minutes
Simply the Best
Beating the Odds
From The Mind of Eric Bischoff x3
Puppies! Puppies!

Hybrid Manuever/Reversals
Sidewalk Slam TB x3
Leg Drag TB x3
Strangle Hold TB x3
Back Rake x2
Eye Rake x3
Nerve Hold x3
Spear x3
Inside Cradle x2
Backslide x3
Goldberg's Spear

Manuevers
Steel Chain Shot TB x3
Shoot Forearm x3
Goldberg's Jackhammer
Arm Breaker
Jackhammer x3
Punch After Punch x2
Atomic Lariat

As you can see I added and removed a bunch.  I don't have Managed By Eric Bischoff or a title belt yet, but I was thinking of replacing Rules Were Meant to Be Broken with one or the other.  I also added a number of new Hybrid reversals, many of which are cheaper meaning I should be able to throw them out sooner and easier.  TB Steel Chainshots were added per suggestions, and I also added 3 Shoot Forearm for damage, especially when I'm behind in fortitude and the fact that they ignore Revolution of the Minds.  Finally Silent, But Violent took the place of the Backlashs I wasn't supposed to have and I added 2 Ready to Fights for more card retrieval.

Thoughts?

[BigPimpin]

In the pre, you can add the following (without losing any current cards and without Managed by Bischoff or titles)

A No Show - searches for 2 Heel cards so you'll always have a Steel Chain Shot TB available to you for Best Laid Plans.  Plus, it'll let you plunk down Rules Were Meant To Be Broken afterwards IIRC, with no detriment.

Old School Antics #3 - why not, right?  It's free

And if you were doing this seriously, the last slot should be something to play against Andre The Giant and/or a feud for playing against Ken Kennedy.

[originaldeadman88]

I recommend under no circumstances that you replace rules were meant to br broken. The card is tailor made for berg but I do say you should pack 2x I cant be reading this rught. Perfect fodder for rules.

[thedragonreborn]

In the pre, you can add the following (without losing any current cards and without Managed by Bischoff or titles)

A No Show - searches for 2 Heel cards so you'll always have a Steel Chain Shot TB available to you for Best Laid Plans.  Plus, it'll let you plunk down Rules Were Meant To Be Broken afterwards IIRC, with no detriment.

Old School Antics #3 - why not, right?  It's free

And if you were doing this seriously, the last slot should be something to play against Andre The Giant and/or a feud for playing against Ken Kennedy.

Okay A No Show sounds good.  I didn't pack an Old School Antics #3 because I only have two.  What would you suggest to handle Andre?  We do have a player in our group that runs him and he's nasty, so it might not be a bad idea to prep for him.

[BigPimpin]

In the pre, you can add the following (without losing any current cards and without Managed by Bischoff or titles)

A No Show - searches for 2 Heel cards so you'll always have a Steel Chain Shot TB available to you for Best Laid Plans.  Plus, it'll let you plunk down Rules Were Meant To Be Broken afterwards IIRC, with no detriment.

Old School Antics #3 - why not, right?  It's free

And if you were doing this seriously, the last slot should be something to play against Andre The Giant and/or a feud for playing against Ken Kennedy.

Okay A No Show sounds good.  I didn't pack an Old School Antics #3 because I only have two.  What would you suggest to handle Andre?  We do have a player in our group that runs him and he's nasty, so it might not be a bad idea to prep for him.

Honestly?  There's a couple of ways you can go with this, but I'd pick one of two: It's Showtime! and/or Managed by Teddy Long.  It's Showtime! will give you turn 1 against Andre, so you'll have a full hand plus the ability to swing at his face with a Jackhammer / Atomic Bear Hug combination.  And Teddy Long will give you a small boost to your hand after We Face wipes it out.

[Philippine Milkfish]

You could also No Show into Luck of the Draw to limit his options after hiding his We Face. It stops both his Giant Headbutt and his silly Grab + Maintain Hold TB combo.

[originaldeadman88]

Heck you might as well run white wedding as well.

[thedragonreborn]

Man having only ten slots in my Backlash is tough.  White Wedding seems like an obvious choice to shut down Andre, but A No Show would be great to grab Steel Chain Shot.  It's Showtime seems like a good way to insure I go first especially against Andre.  Teddy Long is nice to refill my hand, but I think misses the mark.  I was going to skip Luck of the Draw, but I don't know how many times that stupid Giant Head Butt has beaten me.  I guess I'll try Wedding, A Now Show, and It's Showtime and see how it goes from there. Guess you can't prepare for everything huh?

Any suggestions on which fueds are most effective against Kennedy?
 

[Philippine Milkfish]

I'd say Trash Talking TB would be my first pick. Scrambling a key card in his starting hand might just buy you enough time to get started. Otherwise, maybe Backstage Politics for the -1 to his handsize and if you go the Redemption route, there's the bonus to that too.

"It is not the strongest of the species that survive, but the one most responsive to change." - Charles Darwin